Thailand Worried About Drop in Chinese Tourists

[ISAC69]

I would bet good money that if anyone went to Central Festival & looked for it, they would see exactly the kind of Chinese big spending you saw.

And there are still some posters here who continually state the average per day spends of Chinese visitors produced by national tourist organisations are pure lies!

I believe it is, Probably the Thai authorities are manipulating the statistics attribute to the Chinese tourists
far more they actually spend ,
It looks good to shoe substantial growth with tourists numbers comming to Thailand,What the official numbers don't show is that the average Chinese tourists spend very at their vacation in Thailand.

[Jun]

And there are still some posters here who continually state the average per day spends of Chinese visitors produced by national tourist organisations are pure lies!

So it seems.
I don't think any of the dissenters go around and collect their own data in any scientific way, so there is no reason to challenge the official figures.
If they spend time near Tuk Com, they probably see low spending Chinese tourists.
If they go to some of the premium shopping malls in Bangkok, they will see high spending Chinese tourists.
However, neither is a statistically significant sample size.

Also, if other countries such as the UK also recognise Chinese tourists as high spenders (on average), it does add some credibility to the idea that some Chinese tourists spend a lot of money.

Finally, looking at the way certain recent posts are written, it is almost impossible to believe the authors have a better idea of the statistics than the authorities.

[Gaybutton]

I don't think any of the dissenters go around and collect their own data in any scientific way, so there is no reason to challenge the official figures.

Since when are "official" figures reliable?

I can't dispute what you see in the UK because I'm not there. But I know what I see for myself in Pattaya, what others tell me, and I know what shopkeepers tell me. If anyone, especially those who aren't even in Thailand, let alone Pattaya, actually thinks these Chinese tour groups, consisting of people who have to be given pamphlets explaining how to behave, are big spenders, tell me where they are spending it so I can go, see for myself.

Personally, I don't care whether they are big spenders or not. That has nothing to do with me. It's the behavior I hear about, read about, see for myself, and experience myself that I object to. I don't like all the tour buses, but that's not the tourists' fault. And according to recent news articles, there is a significant enough number of illegal tour guides that the police have initiated a crackdown and are checking their paperwork. There has been some arrests as a result.

[fountainhall]

Since when are "official" figures reliable?

I can't dispute what you see in the UK because I'm not there. But I know what I see for myself in Pattaya, what others tell me, and I know what shopkeepers tell me.

Having worked as a consultant for a national tourist organisation, I can affirm that some raw statistics are indeed sometimes massaged. However, in all the cases I witnessed, this was to persuade government leaders to agree either to come up with more cash or to a major change in marketing strategies.

The problem with those who doubt officially published figures is that actual tourism statistics are drawn from a wide variety of sources, then collated and fed to several international tourism bodies. There is thus virtually no reason why statistics should be massaged because these bodies do from time to time send representatives to check them. The main variations arise when looking at the basis on which certain groups of statistics are arrived. For example, one set of statistics issued by Thailand is based only from agents using the services of the Association of Thailand Travel Agents (ATTA). Inevitably this can only give a general view of inbound tourism and may well be skewed to lower spending visitors (my guess).

Unfortunately most of us see and therefore believe only what our eyes and those we talk to tell us. So we base opinions on what happens exclusively in our tiny part of a country. I have no doubt that in Pattaya most tourists from China appear to spend little but peanuts on cheap souvenirs. But then I see some I assume to be from that country in Paragon and Central Embassy walking out of top-end boutiques with several large shopping bags. In that category, Indians are now particularly evident. Some Chinese will, as Jun pointed out in an earlier post, regularly shop at Harrods in London. As most country's outbound tourism develops, it is inevitable that those on cheap package tours become balanced by those on more individually tailored tours and others who make their own arrangements. The latter groups tend to be far higher spenders.

As far as general in bound tourism to Thailand is concerned, numbers are certainly dropping. According to the ATTA (itself no real barometer of actual figures), so far in 2019, the only countries showing a rise are India, Vietnam, Taiwan, France, Ukraine and the USA. In percentage terms, the largest falls are in descending order

UK - 29.39%
Hong Kong - 19.33%
South Korea - 13.77%
China - 12.08%
Malaysia - 10.51
Indonesia - 9.85%
Japan - 8.22%
Germany - 7.77%
Russia - 6.91%

I cannot work out the fall in actual numbers from each country. In the last few years China and Malaysia have sent the most. So it's reasonable to expect the drop in their percentages represents the largest fall in numbers.

http://www.atta.or.th/?p=4019

[Gaybutton]

I see some I assume to be from that country in Paragon and Central Embassy walking out of top-end boutiques with several large shopping bags.

If they didn't arrive on tour buses and led around by a tour guide, then we're talking about two completely different categories of tourists. Guess which one vastly outnumbers the other. You're not really trying to convince me that the tour bus Chinese are doing their shopping at high end boutiques, are you?

[gera]

But then I see some I assume to be from that country in Paragon and Central Embassy walking out of top-end boutiques with several large shopping bags.

But then this group of tourists should be targeted. I recall there was a proposal of Yingluck government to reduce tariffs on luxury goods. That would definitely make sense to attract big spenders. Dropping 2000 baht payment on visas on arrivals do not. Couple of hundred thousands of big spenders from China will hardly justify remaining 9800000 from the same country who spend nothing. And speaking about statistics, average numbers are not necessarily the best measure. The median would be better measure under present circumstances. If I saw that 5 million (out of 10) of Chinese tourists spend at least 200 USD per day that would be much more persuasive in terms of attracting this particular group of tourists. I am sure this is not the case.

[Dodger]

What's really funny about this is that Thailand doesn't have the systems for collecting and analyzing data to even know how many foreigners reside in the Kingdom, let alone how much money the Chinese tourists are spending during their holidays. All they see is a hell of a lot of them coming over here and assume it must be paying dividends.

I took an all inclusive Cruise years ago which made one of its stops in Jamaica. I went on a shore excursion when the boat docked in Montego Bay and ended up in a bar sipping rum and chatting with a cute bar tender. Montego Bay is a popular party place, and the bar sure seemed to have all the right charisma, but for some reason the place was empty. I was a bit surprised when the bartender asked me what kind of discount Royal Caribbean Cruise Line had offered for the ship I was on. I thought about this for a minute, and then told him that they actually offered a promotion where two people could cruise for the price of one. He just laughed and said, that's why my place is empty.

People who can afford to pay full price for a Caribbean Cruise can usually afford to take the shore excursions and spend some money. Those who could not afford to take a Cruise without there being a huge discount, as well as being all inclusive, don't go on shore excursions too often because they can't afford to

I see the same thing happening with this huge influx of mostly middle class Chinese. These cheap all inclusive tours are very attractive and affordable for a huge slice of the Chinese middle class. The bottom line is, the Chinese owned tour companies make out like bandits, but Thailand has to deal with strained internal resources with no real payback.

According to reports related to Wealthy Chinese Vacation Trends, the High Rollers are actually vacationing in China versus traveling internationally due to the continued growth of luxury options becoming available in their own country. That's where the money is being spent.

[Jun]

If they didn't arrive on tour buses and led around by a tour guide, then we're talking about two completely different categories of tourists.

Absolutely. We have the cheap Chinese tourists which you see in Pattaya. Then Fountainhall sees all the high spending tourists in the Bangkok shopping malls.

If the cheap tourists outnumbered the high spenders in Bangkok 3:1 (for example), lets say the cheap ones spend $60 a day.
If the high spenders spend $600 a day, then the average spend comes in at $195 per day, which is perfectly respectable.
Also, it's perfectly feasible for the high spenders to burn through way more than this, by the time we have considered fancy hotels, fancy restaurants and all the luxury goods purchases.

Also, even in Pattaya I know they were putting some Chinese tour groups in the Marriott (before it rebranded) & staying there is not cheap.

[Gaybutton]

If the cheap tourists outnumbered the high spenders in Bangkok 3:1 (for example), lets say the cheap ones spend $60 a day.

Three things I don't know:

1. How much money the tour bus Chinese spend on average per day.
2. How many days those tours actually are. Just a guess, but I'd say 4 days to a week.
3. Where the tours actually take them. Other than Pattaya Beach and the tour bus restaurants, I rarely see them anywhere else. There are plenty of tour buses, but where do they go?

[Undaunted]

3. Where the tours actually take them. Other than Pattaya Beach and the tour bus restaurants, I rarely see them anywhere else. There are plenty of tour buses, but where do they go?

My apartment is just off Thappraya road a few hundred meters from the overpass and nightly both sides of Thappraya have their buses parked bumper to bumper. Other than the current ongoing construction all over town the buses add much to the traffic nightmare. I too never see them anywhere other than in central Pattaya crossing Beach road. I am told Bali High pier is full of them as Koh Larn is a must on their go to list as is Walking street. They appear to only travel in groups, I’ve never encountered individual Chinese tourists anywhere.