TM6 - the arrival and departure cards - to end, TM30 app to be created

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Gaybutton
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TM6 - the arrival and departure cards - to end, TM30 app to be created

Post by Gaybutton »

According to the article, the paperwork involved is stored in 2 warehouses - where nobody looks at any of it. And now they're running out of space to store all the useless paperwork. It seems obvious it would save everyone a lot of time and trouble, along with saving Thailand a lot of money, if they would dump this entire system of obsolete, useless, unnecessary paperwork, and modernize by creating easy to use, reliably working, web sites on which people can do the same self-reporting that they do when they have do it by physically going to immigration offices.

How about taking all that stored paper, making biodegradable bags and food containers out of it, and reduce the use of plastic and styrofoam.

The immigration offices are already overcrowded every day, and much of what goes on there could easily be done online. At least they are talking about doing that with the TM30 and TM28 forms too, and possibly putting an end to those entirely since they do nothing to thwart crime, and serve only to plague law abiding foreigners.

As a law abiding foreigner I hope they'll modernize the laws we need to abide by, make it easier for us to abide by them, and do away with the laws that might have made sense when they were first enacted, but no longer do.
__________________________________________________________________

Goodbye TM6 arrival and departure cards…being scrapped

By Adam Judd

September 18, 2019

Thailand is to scrap the TM6 arrival and departure card for foreign tourists.

Speaking at an event in Bangkok on Tuesday evening, Dr Kobsak Pootrakool from the Prime Minister’s Office said the TM6 card is set to be phased out, while a new app will be launched for TM30 reporting, according to Khaosod English.

In 2017, it was announced that Thai nationals would no longer need to complete the TM6 form and that only foreigners would be required to fill in the form.

But now the TM6 form is to be scrapped altogether as the Immigration Bureau is running out of places to store all the paperwork, Khaosod reported.

Currently all the TM6 forms are stored in two huge warehouses but are seldom looked at after they have are used, so the decision has been taken to make it redundant.

Khaosod English also reported that a new mobile app will be launched to make the process of TM30 reporting much easier.

The news comes after Dr Kobsak revealed last week that he was due to hold a meeting to discuss the controversial TM30 reporting.

Dr Kobsak also revealed that foreigners will also able to do 90 day reporting via a soon to be launched app.

https://thepattayanews.com/2019/09/18/g ... -scrapped/
_____________________________________________________________________________

Gov’t to Scrap Arrival Cards for Foreigners, Introduce TM30 App

By Pravit Rojanaphruk, Senior Staff Writer

September 18, 2019

BANGKOK — A senior government official said Tuesday foreign visitors will soon no longer have to fill out “TM6” arrival and departure forms.

Kobsak Pootrakool, deputy sec-gen to the Prime Minister, also touted a mobile application in the works for 24-hour reporting under the TM30 form system, which has been a source of controversy in recent months. Kobsak said both changes are designed to attract more visitors and accommodate those already living in the kingdom.

“We made the decision last Friday. Within two to three months, life will be much easier [for foreign tourists and expats],” Kobsak said.

He spoke at a gala dinner to celebrate the fifth anniversary of Elite Plus Magazine at a hotel in Bangkok on Tuesday evening, where audience members included ambassadors from ten or so countries.

Explaining the government’s decision, Kobsak said arrival and departure forms for tourists, known as TM6 forms, have led to a storage problems. The government expects a total of 20 million visitors to Thailand this year.

“[The immigration police] have to have a huge warehouse to store these papers,” Kobsak said, adding that the police rarely look at the information in the forms, which are only stored “just in case.”

He also said the government and the immigration police agreed last Friday to streamline other procedures. Foreigners will be able to report their whereabouts with just “four clicks” on a smartphone to fulfill regulations that require them to report to immigration authorities every 90 days.

But the cherry on top seems to the revelation that the police are developing a mobile phone application for the infamous TM30 form, which requires foreign residents and their Thai landlords to file a report to the police every time the former spends a night outside their registered province.

Tourists are generally exempted from the rule, as the forms are filed by their hotels and accommodation hosts.

Deputy immigration commander Nattapon Sawaengkit confirmed the move on Wednesday when reached for comment, but assigned another officer to explain the details.

The officer, who declined to give his name, gave little information other than hinting that QR codes will likely be used.

“The apps are not finished yet. QR codes will likely be used but it’s not concrete yet. It will likely be on a smartphone,” the officer said.

Harsher enforcement of TM30 forms has recently driven expats in Thailand to air their grievances on social media. They say the 40-year-old regulation is outdated and should be amended or scrapped entirely.

The European Association for Business and Commerce, which represents European firms and businesses in Thailand, also urged reforms to TM30 in a statement to Kobsak yesterday.

Speaking to reporters on Tuesday night, Kobsak said the law will still remain on the books, but pledged to end foreigners’ discontent with the form. He also acknowledged the government should do better in attracting foreign investment and manpower.

http://www.khaosodenglish.com/news/busi ... -tm30-app/

fountainhall

Re: TM6 - the arrival and departure cards - to end, TM30 app to be created

Post by fountainhall »

This arrival/departure card was redesigned a couple of years ago, The attenpt was to simplify it but then the TOT got involved and insisted on additional information being included. So the revamped form includes more information than most arrival cards anywhere in the world.

Now we learn this was all a childish nonsense - because no-one in Immigration even has the time to even look at them. All that detailed information deemed so necessary by the TOT is nothing but a charade, never even seen by the TOT. This is such a mind-blowingly idiotic folly, it is surely indicative of the Immigration Department's utter and absolute incompetence!

What, I wonder, happens to the vast reams of paperwork I see stacked on floors, on the top of cupboards and seemingly everywhere when I make my annual visit to the awful government building at Chaengwattana. And whilst on the subject of that building, what sensible government anywhere would design a building with such a monstrously large empty atrium that must cover about half of its usable space and so cost a fortune in taxpayer funds to air condition every day?

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Re: TM6 - the arrival and departure cards - to end, TM30 app to be created

Post by Gaybutton »

fountainhall wrote:
Thu Sep 19, 2019 9:28 am
what sensible government anywhere would design a building with such a monstrously large empty atrium
Maybe it was designed by Ed's Architecture and Car Wash . . .

fountainhall

Re: TM6 - the arrival and departure cards - to end, TM30 app to be created

Post by fountainhall »

Gaybutton wrote:
Thu Sep 19, 2019 9:55 am
Maybe it was designed by Ed's Architecture and Car Wash . . .
Even with the bank branches and food outlets, there is still room there for about 40 car wash operations, to say nothing of quadruple the number of offices on the higher floors!

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Re: TM6 - the arrival and departure cards - to end, TM30 app to be created

Post by 2lz2p »

fountainhall wrote:
Thu Sep 19, 2019 9:28 am
This arrival/departure card was redesigned a couple of years ago, The attenpt was to simplify it but then the TOT got involved and insisted on additional information being included. So the revamped form includes more information than most arrival cards anywhere in the world.

Now we learn this was all a childish nonsense - because no-one in Immigration even has the time to even look at them. All that detailed information deemed so necessary by the TOT is nothing but a charade, never even seen by the TOT. This is such a mind-blowingly idiotic folly, it is surely indicative of the Immigration Department's utter and absolute incompetence!
Just to clarify, did you mean to say TOT (Telephone Organization of Thailand) or did you intend to say TAT (Tourism Authority of Thailand)?

As to the News article, it will be interesting to see what develops -- what will be required, e.g., scanned documents, etc.?

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Re: TM6 - the arrival and departure cards - to end, TM30 app to be created

Post by Dodger »

fountainhall wrote:
Thu Sep 19, 2019 9:28 am
This arrival/departure card was redesigned a couple of years ago, The attenpt was to simplify it but then the TOT got involved and insisted on additional information being included. So the revamped form includes more information than most arrival cards anywhere in the world.

Now we learn this was all a childish nonsense - because no-one in Immigration even has the time to even look at them. All that detailed information deemed so necessary by the TOT is nothing but a charade, never even seen by the TOT. This is such a mind-blowingly idiotic folly, it is surely indicative of the Immigration Department's utter and absolute incompetence!
It's almost scary, but you're absolutely correct.

I've been beating my head against the wall for months trying to figure out Immigration's motives behind these ridiculous report forms and hit a dead end every time. The simple fact is that they are just flat-out utterly incompetent, as you have stated.

Why the Immigration Commission gives TAT so much power is also mind blowing. Every single time TAT gets involved in anything that has to do with immigration matters, total chaos erupts, and everything gets totally screwed up.

Maybe if they let TAT just focus on Tourism, the Police just focus on crime and terrorism, and Immigration to focus of processing visa extensions, they just might be able to do their jobs without fucking up everything they touch.

One has to wonder what the Chairman of the Immigration Commissions role is in all of this.

fountainhall

Re: TM6 - the arrival and departure cards - to end, TM30 app to be created

Post by fountainhall »

2lz2p wrote:
Thu Sep 19, 2019 2:46 pm
Just to clarify, did you mean to say TOT (Telephone Organization of Thailand) or did you intend to say TAT (Tourism Authority of Thailand)?
Thanks for spotting my mistake. It should have been TAT. Apologies!

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Re: TM6 - the arrival and departure cards - to end, TM30 app to be created

Post by Dodger »

I have a feeling that this Paper Form nightmare won't go away any time soon.

It's becoming more and more evident that Thailand' has not transitioned to using modern Operating Systems which would allow them to go paperless. We have all witnessed the use of these outdated paper forms, records, reports, etc., as used in Thailand's Land Office, Drivers License Bureau, Immigration Check Points, State Hospitals, School Systems, Police Department, and others, which is a pretty good indication that they simply don't have the Operating Systems which government agencies, as well as all other businesses in the West, starting implementing 50 years ago.

It's easy to think that they could just design a better App to process these TM forms that we're talking about, but it is very likely that the operating systems they currently have in place simply won't support the Apps they need. Most of the larger companies in the West, including government agencies, rely on operating systems like JDE, SAP and BAAN to run their operations paperless. At the very least, companies have one of the latest versions of Windows to run their operations. I'm starting to wonder if they even use something comparable to Windows.

Implementing a new operating system is a very costly and time consuming process, which could take years, if not longer to implement. Training the users of the system typically takes 12 months after a system like this is installed.

Just the fact that they've warehoused years of TM6 arrival cards is evidence enough to tell you that they don't have a system capable of electronic storage. Even a cheap lap top computer with a basic Windows operating system can store thousands of records and files electronically.

Just one month ago the headlines were "Hotels are not doing the TM30 reporting as required". Well, who the hell knows, if, in fact Immigration takes completed forms and tosses them in a warehouse somewhere like they do with the TM6 cards, it's anybody's guess. Smoke and Mirrors!

Why they are so many decades behind the modern world is anyone's guess, but one thing's for sure, they have a lot of work cut out for themselves and it will take a decade to accomplish this in the current climate.

The solution to this problem belongs to them, and only them. We are only guests here (remember?). So when they have their operating systems in place and all the immigration forms we're talking about are simple and electronic, we can all celebrate, but , in the mean time, the problem belongs to them, not the expat community, like some would want you to believe. More Smoke and Mirrors!

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Re: TM6 - the arrival and departure cards - to end, TM30 app to be created

Post by Gaybutton »

Dodger wrote:
Thu Sep 19, 2019 5:11 pm
Implementing a new operating system is a very costly and time consuming process, which could take years, if not longer to implement. Training the users of the system typically takes 12 months after a system like this is installed.
I know a way they could eliminate the problem immediately. It's very simple. Just do away with those forms.

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Re: TM6 - the arrival and departure cards - to end, TM30 app to be created

Post by Gaybutton »

Along with the other information contained in this video by Pattaya News, toward the end of the video it is announced that Thailand plans to introduce an "easy-to-use" app that will take care of the 90-day address report, eliminating the need to physically go to immigration to submit the report.



Unfortunately, the video also confirms that so far retirement visa holders still are legally required to submit a TM28, at the immigration office, when returning home from a trip out of your residence province if that trip is 24 hours or longer.

If you are confused, the TM28 and the 90-day address report are two different forms. The 90-cay address report is the TM47 form. At least an app is planned for the TM47. How about an app for the TM28 as well, or better still, just getting rid of both of them entirely.

To view the various immigration forms and/or download the ones you need, see: http://bangkok.immigration.go.th/en/bas ... e=download

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