65,000 per month baht retirement visa requirement - review

[Gaybutton]

I can't review it myself because I don't use it. However many do and many who do the 800,000 baht requirement are seriously considering switching over the the 65,000 baht per month method for retirement visa extensions.

I, and I think many others too, would greatly appreciate it if some of you who do use the 65,000 baht method walk us through exactly what is required, what paperwork is needed, and where to get it, and what, if any, fees are involved.

Can some of you walk us through, step-by-step exactly what to do and how far in advance of the extension date you recommend getting started with it?

[Dodger]

I've used the 65,000/month method since retiring and haven't experienced any problems to date:

Documents needed to renew visa extension using 65k/month income method:

1 – Passport
2 - Application for Extension of Stay (TM7)
3 -2X2 Passport Size Photograph
4 - Photo copy of pages from passport - Identification page and all transfer stamps, all Extensions of Stay, and Last entry into Thailand
5 - Photo Copy Departure Card (TM6)
6 - Photo Copy of Bank Passbook pages showing all transactions for previous 12 months - (must show 65,000 baht minimum)
7 - Bank Letter listing previous 12 month deposits from foreign source (obtain from your bank)
8 – Bank Credit Advice Report showing details of previous 12 month foreign deposits (obtain from bank)
9 - Copy of Condo or House Ownership Book/Deed (renters need to bring a copy of rental agreement and copy of owners I.D. card)
10 - Copy of document showing source of income - in my case this is Social Security Income Summary Report (obtained online)

* Sign all documents at bottom of each page as a time-saver when you get to Immigration.

General Instructions:
Visit your bank in the morning, on the same day that you go to immigration to renew your visa.
Make a small transaction in your account (deposit or withdrawal) which just shows immigration that your account is current and active.
Obtain Bank Letter listing the previous 12 month deposits coming from a foreign source.
Obtain Bank Credit Advice Report for the same 12 month period.
My Bank (Bangkok Bank) charges around 500 baht for the two Reports mentioned above.

After they (Immigration) reviews your documentation they'll give you a queue number which you'll need to pick up your visa when they are finished processing it. My new visa's are always ready to be picked up at Immigration the following day.

Note: Immigration did not request additional copies of any of the documents I presented (as
shown above) but I bring extras just in case.

Here is a link to the TM7 Application Form. I print a copy at home - fill it out - and save the time and hassle at Immigration:

file:///C:/Users/Acer/Desktop/Vic%20Doc's/Visa%20Application%20TM7%20Form.pdf

Good luck - and I strongly recommend the 65k method for anyone who qualifies.

Cheers

[2lz2p]

I also use the 65k monthly income method and renew my extension annually at Chonburi (Pattaya) Immigration on Jomtien Beach Road Soi 5. I generally agree with Dodger's comments above, but I have added some comments as noted below. Also, the Pattaya City Expats Club has a checklist of the documents needed for both the 800k in bank and 65k monthly method -
https://pcec.club/CHECKLISTS-Extensions-of-Stay.

Documents needed to renew visa extension using 65k/month income method:

1 – Passport
2 - Application for Extension of Stay (TM7)
3 -2X2 Passport Size Photograph [on my renewal last June, they gave the photo back to me and took my picture with their camera - but suggest you have it as it is a required item for the TM.7 Application]
4 - Photo copy of pages from passport - Identification page and all transfer stamps, all Extensions of Stay, and Last entry into Thailand
5 - Photo Copy Departure Card (TM6)
6 - Photo Copy of Bank Passbook pages showing all transactions for previous 12 months - (must show 65,000 baht minimum) [If your Embassy still provides a certification of monthly income, you will only need a copy of the identity page from your bank passbook. In my case, I do not receive such a certification. I had not updated my passbook for several months, so it showed a net entry for deposits/withdrawals during that period - not a problem as they rely on the bank letter mentioned in item 7 -- ]
7 - Bank Letter listing previous 12 month deposits from foreign source (obtain from your bank) [It will need to show at least 65k deposit from foreign source in each of the 12 months prior to the application for extension date - NOTE: You do not need this letter if your Embassy still provides a certification of monthly income, you will provide that certification instead]
8 – Bank Credit Advice Report showing details of previous 12 month foreign deposits (obtain from bank) [I have never needed Credit Advice reports, but instead get bank statements for the previous 12 months so the Bank Branch can prepare the letter mentioned in 7 above - I have them with me, but Immigration does not want them, the letter in item 7 above is what they want to see]
9 - Copy of Condo or House Ownership Book/Deed (renters need to bring a copy of rental agreement and copy of owners I.D. card) [I use my lease agreement which includes a copy of the owner's ID - in addition, I also include a copy of the owner's house book page]
10 - Copy of document showing source of income - in my case this is Social Security Income Summary Report (obtained online) [As a retired Federal Government employee, I provided a certification from the Office of Personnel Management showing the amount of my monthly pension - I download a pdf file from the OPM website containing the certification]
[ADDED 11. Bank letter verifying the name, account number, and latest balance which should be dated the date you apply or, if doing early in the morning before the banks open as I do, the day before - this is the same bank letter that is also required for those using the 800k in the bank method]]
* Sign all documents at bottom of each page as a time-saver when you get to Immigration. [TM.7 to be signed on 1st & 2nd page where indicated - ALSO add your telephone number to the TM.7 - photocopied documents to be signed as Dodger suggests, do not sign the two bank letters - one listing foreign deposits & the other verifying the account - as they are originals signed by the bank representative]

General Instructions:
Visit your bank in the morning, on the same day that you go to immigration to renew your visa.
Make a small transaction in your account (deposit or withdrawal) which just shows immigration that your account is current and active. [Make the transaction, then update the passbook so it shows the transaction]
Obtain Bank Letter listing the previous 12 month deposits coming from a foreign source. [The branch can prepare the letter from your passbook provided it has been updated regularly and includes a listing showing the required deposit of at least 65k baht from a foreign source in each of the 12 months preceding the application for extension - otherwise, you will need to order bank statements for the preceding 12 months from which they can get this information - note, for Bangkok Bank account holders, the branch will have to request the statements from HQ which takes at least 5 business days for them to receive it - note, this letter can be obtained prior to the application date so long as it shows the last 65k deposit was made during the month you are making your application]
Obtain Bank Credit Advice Report for the same 12 month period. [As mentioned above, I get certified bank statements which are used by the Bank branch to prepare the letter listing foreign deposits, but getting a Credit Advice Report for each deposit would also be sufficient - as with getting the statements Bangkok Bank, they can only do it for the past 6 months; anything older must be ordered from HQ -- one way to avoid this is to get certified statements or Credit Advice during the first 6 month period which the Branch can provide at that time]
My Bank (Bangkok Bank) charges around 500 baht for the two Reports mentioned above. [I don't recall the exact fee I paid Bangkok Bank for my 12 months of statements and the two letters, but as I recall it was 300 baht for the statements and 100 baht each for the letters - since Dodger gets the Credit Advice Reports, it appears the bank fee is the same for either.]

After they (Immigration) reviews your documentation they'll give you a queue number which you'll need to pick up your visa when they are finished processing it. My new visa's are always ready to be picked up at Immigration the following day. [You can get the queue number from the main desk in the new building - door closest to the street - OR you can go to the last door in the new building - furthest from the street - to the "Retirement" desk (there are signs at the entry door and on the desk). Unless there are several ahead of you, they will as Dodger mentions, look over your documents, issue you a queue number for Desk 8, and instruct you to proceed to that desk in the main building. When your queue number is called (there is also a large wall display showing queue numbers being served at each of the desks on the back wall), the Immigration Officer will go through your documents and if all is in order, take your 1,900 baht fee, have you sign two documents which are in Thai (one acknowledging overstay penalties and the other that you are aware that you have to report to Immigration if any of the circumstances qualifying you for the extension change), and give you a "claim check" with a number telling you to come back the next day after 2pm to pick up your passport.]

Note: Immigration did not request additional copies of any of the documents I presented (as
shown above) but I bring extras just in case.

Here is a link to the TM7 Application Form. I print a copy at home - fill it out - and save the time and hassle at Immigration:

file:///C:/Users/Acer/Desktop/Vic%20Doc's/Visa%20Application%20TM7%20Form.pdf

The above link appears to be a document on Dodger's hard drive. The Pattaya City Expats Club has a link to the document on their website which is: https://pcec.club/Extending-Stay - scroll down to and click on the "click here" link for either the Word or the PDF version:

What form and documents do I need to obtain an extension of stay and what is the fee?

You will need to complete Immigration Form TM.7, Application for Extension of Temporary Stay in the Kingdom and submit it at the Thai Immigration Office having jurisdiction for the area where you are currently residing.

Click here for the TM.7 as a Microsoft Word file or click here for the TM.7 as a PDF file.

[Gaybutton]

Thank you Dodger and 2lz2p. It doesn't get more clear or detailed than that. I, and I know many others, are very grateful for all the work you put into these posts.

The only thing I don't understand - and this is so minor you needn't bother to respond - is what's the difference between the bank letter and the credit advice report - and why do they require both?

I would think police, such as Big Joke, trying to stop criminals from being in Thailand via the retirement visa would actually prefer expats to use the 65,000 baht per month method. Seems to me it is a lot easier for criminals to just put 800,000 baht into a Thai bank account than it would be for criminals to come up with 12 months worth of bank letters, credit advice reports, and proof of the income source.

While I realize that not everybody who is perfectly and legitimately eligible for the retirement visa has money sent to their Thai bank account every month, it would make sense to me if they start emphasizing a preference for the 65,000 baht per month method.

[Dodger]

The only thing I don't understand - and this is so minor you needn't bother to respond - is what's the difference between the bank letter and the credit advice report - and why do they require both?

The bank letter confirms the fact that your funds (last 12 monthly overseas deposits) are coming from a foreign source. The credit advice is a report that shows additional data such as the exchange rate at the time of deposit, etc., but as 2Lz2P correctly stated they (Immigration) stopped asking for this form several years ago. I continue to obtain a copy from my bank anyway and have it with me when I go to Immigration just in case they start asking for the damn thing again. Up2U.

Understanding that each persons financial situation is unique, I opted to use the 65k method from the start because of a miracle that occurred right before my retirement in 2018 - where the U.S. Social Security Administration (SSA) added Thailand to its list of approved countries where international deposits could be processed. That being the case, and knowing that my monthly SSA payments would reliably exceed the 65k minimum I was all set. Additional money that I receive from my retirement pension (modest as it is) goes directly to my U.S. bank account which I still wanted to maintain anyway.

To offset any risk in the future associated with the exchange rate I also maintain a separate Thai account with >800,000 THB just so I never have to worry about this crap.

Happy sailing!

[2lz2p]

The only thing I don't understand - and this is so minor you needn't bother to respond - is what's the difference between the bank letter and the credit advice report - and why do they require both?

I would think police, such as Big Joke, trying to stop criminals from being in Thailand via the retirement visa would actually prefer expats to use the 65,000 baht per month method. Seems to me it is a lot easier for criminals to just put 800,000 baht into a Thai bank account than it would be for criminals to come up with 12 months worth of bank letters, credit advice reports, and proof of the income source.

For those that cannot get an Embassy certification of monthly income (USA, UK, & Australia), they will need the bank letter listing all foreign deposits to their account. The Pattaya Immigration Officer don't want to go through detail transactions in the passbook or bank statements to identify foreign deposits of 65k monthly from a foreign source. Thus, they want the bank to provide a letter listing such deposits.

In order for the bank to prepare the letter, they can use the passbook entries provided it has been kept updated on a regular basis. Otherwise, they need either bank statements or a Credit Advice (CA) report for each deposit.

Bangkok Bank shows foreign deposits on the bank statements or in the passbook with the "FTT" code which means the source was from outside of Thailand. Other banks probably have a similar code. A Credit Advice Report is simply a document that shows the detail for the deposit, i.e. source of the funds.

However, if one uses Wise, as I and many others do, it may become necessary to get a CA Report. Wise uses Bangkok Bank and Kasikorn Bank as their partner bank where they keep baht funds on deposit. When you transfer funds through Wise, they will instruct one of their partner banks to transfer money from their account to the recipients bank account. In the past there were some problems when Wise used Kasikorn bank to fund a transfer to a Bangkok Bank account or vice versa. These transfers showed up in the recipients bank account coded as a "domestic" transfer.

Wise now advises their customers to use "long stay Thailand" as the reason for their transfer if they have a Bangkok Bank or Kasikorn Bank account as a means to ensure that Wise's system will transfer the funds using the bank where the recipient's account is located. IF the recipient's bank is other then Bangkok Bank or Kasikorn Bank, the funds will come from Wise's partner bank, thus being recorded in the recipient's account as a "domestic" transfer.

In situations where a Wise Transfer shows up as a domestic transfer, the Wise "receipt" which can be accessed and downloaded from their website, will show which of their partner banks provided the funds to the recipient's account. The recipient, if using the 65k monthly income method and not being able to provided an Embassy certification, must go to the partner bank used for that transaction and obtain a CA Report for that transaction. The CA Report will show the funds originated outside of Thailand.

It seems that Chonburi (Pattaya) Immigration may be the only one that insists on the bank letter listing foreign deposits. I have seen reports from those using other Immigration Offices that they have been able to use just their passbook, bank statements, or Wise "Receipts" (if the passbook or bank statement doesn't identify the deposit as foreign).

[Gaybutton]

It seems that Chonburi (Pattaya) Immigration may be the only one that insists on the bank letter listing foreign deposits. I have seen reports from those using other Immigration Offices that they have been able to use just their passbook, bank statements, or Wise "Receipts" (if the passbook or bank statement doesn't identify the deposit as foreign).

That is one of the reasons why I'm hoping the new administration will get around to standardizing all of the immigration offices so that they are all operating under the same rules, which is what I would have thought they are supposed to be doing anyway. But this nonsense of different immigration offices, usually for senseless reasons, just making up their own rules or choosing to ignore rules - that needs to stop. Just based on what you wrote, if I go to the Pattaya office with precisely the same documents most other immigration offices readily accept, I'll be denied the extension. Why in Pattaya should applicants have to submit additional documents that applicants elsewhere don't have to submit?

Along with that, you never know when there might be additional rule changes an immigration office comes up with on its own, regardless of what the law mandates. Of course, you might be well aware of the law and perhaps even be able to show documentation proving that you are correct. Wonderful. Go ahead, try arguing with them . . .

This is yet another reason why I always recommend applying for the extension as far in advance of the expiration date as possible, to give yourself time to come up with whatever else they might require beyond what you brought with you..

[Undaunted]

I use the 800,000 method and I question how to transition to the 65,000 monthly method……as I read it only after finishing the 12 month of 65,000 deposits can you use your 800,000, BTW amending existing visa rules is on the agenda of the new government, my expectations are among other things the 800,000 minimum will be raised as well as the 65,000 as stated by “Big Joke”.

[Jun]

Why in Pattaya should applicants have to submit additional documents that applicants elsewhere don't have to submit?

The more difficult they make it, the more likely people are to use agencies. I noticed the Pattaya immigration office is rather too crowded to discretely discuss and hand over tea money. Outsourcing that to an agency solves the problem.

Even for the simple matter of a 30 day extension, it was far easier in Hua Hin than Pattaya.

An advantage of the 800,000 baht method is that one has the 800,000 baht irrespective of what the exchange rate does.
Anyone with 65,000 baht overseas income doesn't know what that will be in 1 years time. It might be 40,000 or 80,000 baht, all depending on what the exchange rate does. Not a problem as long as there's a big safety margin with the overseas income.

[Dodger]

I use the 800,000 method and I question how to transition to the 65,000 monthly method……as I read it only after finishing the 12 month of 65,000 deposits can you use your 800,000.

From what I understand all you need to do is provide Immigration with your bank book & bank letter showing that you've received 65k or more for the last 12 consecutive months in order to renew your visa extension using the 65k method. Unless I'm mistaking, it doesn't matter which method you used the previous year.

I think where some people get in trouble is when they think they can switch from the 800k method to the 65k method before they have actually received the required 12 consecutive foreign deposits in their Thai bank account. If that makes sense.

Conversely, if someone wanted to switch from the 65k method to the 800k method they would have to show proof that the 800k minimum was in their Thai bank account for the required amount of time.

If it were me, and I was transferring from the 800k method to the 65k method I would make sure that the 800,000 THB remained in my Thai bank account until after the new visa was in my hands. So you might have to hold off on buying 6 more motorbikes for a few days...