Retirement extension

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Dodger
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Re: Retirement extension

Post by Dodger » Thu Jun 13, 2019 3:08 pm

I stopped in at Bangkok Bank Buriram today to make a withdrawal. The bank wasn't too busy so I decided to do a trial run at getting the Annual Bank Statement similar to the one I will need when I apply for my Extension to Stay in September..

They (this branch anyway) referred to what I was requesting simply as an "Account Statement". They produced a copy in 10 minutes and charged me 100 baht. The Statement clearly lists all foreign deposits made since I opened the account and was signed and stamped by a bank representative.

The time it took to produce this online report and the fee charged is consistent with the information I received from the Pattaya Branch (second road) last month.

I would avoid using small satellite branches when requesting this Statement and just go to a main branch where they actually know how to use their computers.

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ceejay
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Re: Retirement extension

Post by ceejay » Thu Jun 13, 2019 3:13 pm

This is absolutley my last post in this thread.Dodger and Fountainhall, feel free to have the last word if you wish.1

Dodger. I would be sorry to fall out with you. I have always admired your posts, but you are being unfair to me here. You are implying, quite strongly, that I am advocating non participation in the discussion of immigration matters. I am not, and never have. I have tried to give my assistance, here and elsewhere, to others on this subject, and it even has been appreciated sometimes.
I do not know what NASA has to do with it. I have not said all speculation is undesirable - just one particular instance of it. You and I are differing on a particular issue. So be it.

Fountainhall. You say that:
...I cannot see individual Immigration agents taking hints from a small handful of retired ranters on a farang message board.
Nor can I. Which is why it is not what I said. What I did say was that many people had read this speculation and had taken it up with visa agents or direct with immigration. There was a big multiplier at work. They probably were not, in the main, the same group as the ranters although there may have been some overlap.

and
At Immigration in Bangkok where I renew my visa, I find it impossible to believe a lowly agent would approach a supervisor and say, "Hey Boss, I've got a great idea to tighten up the regulations for retirees.
The agents are not "lowly" in Chiang Mai which is the immigration office I know about. Apart from a few small operations, all of the visa agents in Chiang Mai (at any rate the ones used by Farang) are at least part owned by former or serving senior immigration officers. They are not selling you someone to fill in your visa form (you can do that yourself) or someone to stand in a queue for you (300 baht). They charge 5000 baht for access and influence and are therefore not, of necessity, lowly.

and
Perhaps questions from visa applicants might give a bad apple or two an idea of a way to get a brown envelope.
It seemed quite organised here. All the apples were bad. Immigration were only issuing a handful of TM30's per day, and refusing extensions to people who did not have them. Miraculously, an agency just next door was able to get any number of TM30's at 5 minutes notice. You didn't even lose your place the queue - it was no more trouble than going to get an overlooked photocopy - If you paid. There are 20,000 retirement visa holders in Chiang - at 500 baht a time, you only need to get 10% of them like this to make your million.

and
But generally, to consider that the speculations on farang-oriented gay chat rooms like this one with relatively tiny readerships will affect policy in any way whatsoever, stretches the boundaries way too far.
Which is why I said
I don't suppose it matters much here"
In my post. Perhaps you missed that?
and
Further, what has been discussed and speculated here has, in large part, been aired to a vastly wider public in the boring letters columns of the the Bangkok Post and the soon to disappear The Nation.
To paraphrase my mother If the Nation and Bangkok Post were to put their heads in the fire, would that mean you should do it? Repetition is the oxygen of gossip, and if the gossip is harmful then it should be smothered by depriving it of repetition.

And that, gentlemen, is me finished on this subject. Feel free to stamp me with the sign of the beast if you so wish.

Dodger
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Re: Retirement extension

Post by Dodger » Thu Jun 13, 2019 4:55 pm

ceejay,

I for one appreciate anything you have to say on the subject and would certainly not want you to ever take anything I say as being personal.

This topic has had people's heads spinning for months and is probably not over yet.

Regardless of the topic, the opinions, the inevitable disagreements that come with the territory, the most important thing, to me anyway, is to remember that we're all in this together. We may not always agree with each others opinions - but we can always respect each other.

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Re: Retirement extension

Post by fountainhall » Thu Jun 13, 2019 5:53 pm

ceejay - as with many topics, there can be a wide divergence of views on this and other chat forums. Like everyone, I base what i say and what I suggest on my own experience. It's surely perfectly possible for one to disagree with another and for one group to disagree with a group of others. It's the same as if one is with a group of friends in a pub having a drink and a chat. It's unrealistic to expect the members of that group always to have the same views and to avoid the occasional heated discussion.

If my comments on this thread have upset you, then I apologise for that. But I believe I have a right to express my views exactly as you have the same right. And I will leave it at that for the moment. But I may - or may not - add further comments here depending on how the thread develops. Thanks to your posts, I shall be a bit wiser of the bigger picture.

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2lz2p
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Re: Retirement extension

Post by 2lz2p » Sat Jun 15, 2019 9:09 am

Dodger wrote:
Thu Jun 13, 2019 3:08 pm
I stopped in at Bangkok Bank Buriram today to make a withdrawal. The bank wasn't too busy so I decided to do a trial run at getting the Annual Bank Statement similar to the one I will need when I apply for my Extension to Stay in September..

They (this branch anyway) referred to what I was requesting simply as an "Account Statement". They produced a copy in 10 minutes and charged me 100 baht. The Statement clearly lists all foreign deposits made since I opened the account and was signed and stamped by a bank representative.

The time it took to produce this online report and the fee charged is consistent with the information I received from the Pattaya Branch (second road) last month.

I would avoid using small satellite branches when requesting this Statement and just go to a main branch where they actually know how to use their computers.
Dodger, thank you for your information. You mention the account information was since you opened your account -- how long ago was that? Was it more than six months of activity? If so, could you scan a copy (omitting your personal information of course) so that others can see what this letter looks like and can download it and provide a copy to the Bangkok Bank office they use - terminology can be a problem and, as they say, a picture is worth a thousand words (or more if one is trying to get around the language differences :) ).

Also, it appears others have encountered a problem because they didn't have a bank certification (answers GB's question re whether Jomtien Immigration Office is requiring a bank certification of monthly deposits from a foreign account) and not being able to get 12 months of activity from their local Bangkok Bank office. I received an email yesterday letting me know the problems the sender encountered at Jomtien Immigration Office this past week because the didn't have such a bank certification. Here is an excerpt:
I went back to the bank showed them a copy of the letter, they will accept, with all the transfers and asked them to do the same thing from my account. They gave me one letter going back only to October and said they could not go back 12 months. Immigration refused that also, saying I must show 12 months of transfers. I went back to the bank and asked if there was any way they could go back 12 months because immigration insists on that.

After much deliberation and phone calls, she said it would have to come from Bangkok, and it would take a few days.
If they could do from October, that is more than 6 months, but still less than the 12 months Jomtien Immigration is wanting.

As I previously mentioned, the Bangkok Bank Office at Tesco-Lotus South, told me they had to get statements for 12 months from Bangkok (I asked for 12 months of activity so didn't ask then how many months they could provide locally) - their fee was 200 baht. The reason I used a satellite branch is because my main Branch as well as the one close to Jomtien Immigration both have steep stairs to climb to get to customer service counter - in my present medical condition, navigating such stairs is not possible, thus the reason I chose the Tesco-Lotus South customer service counter - I started early in anticipation that it would take them a week to obtain the statements as I had previously read in other reports that this would be the case.

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Re: Retirement extension

Post by Dodger » Sat Jun 15, 2019 2:54 pm

2lz2p wrote:
Sat Jun 15, 2019 9:09 am
You mention the account information was since you opened your account -- how long ago was that?
I started receiving direct U.S. deposits in my new account at Bangkok Bank in January. There were 6 monthly deposits on record when I requested the Account Statement.

I'm going to Jomtien Immigration next Tuesday and will show them a copy of the Account Statement I received from Bangkok Bank to see if this is acceptable. If it is acceptable I will scan a copy and share it here.

Having a separate letter from the bank certifying that the information on the Account Summary is correct would be a total waste of time due to the fact that the Account Statement is stamped, dated, and signed by a bank representative, which, in fact, is certifying it's accuracy. A copy of the Account Statement, along with you Bank Book I believe is what they're looking for. Of course we also need a Letter from the source of our foreign income, i.e., social security, retirement pensioner, etc. I will try to get this confirmed on Tuesday as well. I'm requesting a meeting with the Captain, but could end up talking to the guy who sweeps the floors.

Also, the last time I visited Jomtien Immigration I was informed that, in the event there are less than 12 months of deposits on record due to the fact that the requirements for having direct deposits were just finalized in January of this year and 12 consecutive months haven't occurred yet, then the Captain at the Immigration office would have to review and approve this. This is consistent with the apparent leniency there were going to show in 2019. Now, if they actually plan on supporting this, your guess is as good as mine.

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Gaybutton
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Re: Retirement extension

Post by Gaybutton » Sat Jun 15, 2019 3:47 pm

Dodger wrote:
Sat Jun 15, 2019 2:54 pm
Having a separate letter from the bank certifying that the information on the Account Summary is correct would be a total waste of time due to the fact that the Account Statement is stamped, dated, and signed by a bank representative, which, in fact, is certifying it's accuracy. A copy of the Account Statement, along with you Bank Book I believe is what they're looking for. Of course we also need a Letter from the source of our foreign income, i.e., social security, retirement pensioner, etc. I will try to get this confirmed on Tuesday as well.
This is why I'm planning to have to continue with the 800,000 baht method for the time being. If one is using the 65,000 baht per month method, it seems like a lot of hoops to jump though - and you still can't be sure what immigration wants and will accept.

When you talk to immigration, not that I expect a satisfactory answer, but when they tell you what documentation they want, see if you can get them to tell you if that is what immigration nationwide requires as a matter of policy or what the individual screening officer requires.

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Re: Retirement extension

Post by Dodger » Tue Jun 18, 2019 5:28 pm

I went to JomtIen Immigration today to do my 90 day reporting, as well as to get clarification on several issues regarding Long Stay Visa requirements from Immigration top management.

My first discussion was with the gentleman who is responsible for approving all long stay extensions at the Jomtien District. I handed him a copy of the Bangkok Bank Foreign Deposit Verification Letter and U.S. Social Security Financial Verification Statement, both of which are needed for renewal of retirement visa's (Long Stay Extension) using the 65k baht/month method. I asked him to simply review these documents and tell me if they were acceptable or not. He reviewed both documents and his response was that they were both acceptable. Note, that my renewal isn't due until September and this was simply a fact-finding mission.

BANK LETTER

When getting the Bank Letter be sure to tell the bank teller that this Letter is for Immigration purposes and refer to it as Foreign Deposit Verification Letter. Specify the period you want the report to cover which would typically be the last 12 months. Review the Letter when it is completed to make sure all monthly deposits are clearly displayed. It takes 10 minutes to produce the Letter and costs 100 baht.

The Letter consists of a generic cover page which is dated. The second page is a summary of the monthly foreign deposits processed for the specified period. The remaining pages are entitled "Credit Advice". A Credit Advice is simply the details of each individual deposit transaction which frankly no one at Immigration will be concerned with but leave these attached to your Letter anyway.

Make sure to get this Letter the same day you go to Immigration to extend your retirement visa. They will check the date. The new policy states that this Letter must be produced by your bank within 3 days of your renewal application, but, unfortunately, some Immigration personnel are apparently not following this policy and requesting that the Letter be dated the same day.

Make sure to make a simple transaction at your bank on the same day as your trip to Immigration to prove that your bank book details are current.

This may sound confusing, but it's not. Get the bank letter. Make sure it shows each monthly deposit for the period specified. leave the Credit Advice's the bank clerk hands you attached to the Letter, and do it all on the same day That's it.

FINANCIAL VERIFICATION

As we all know, we also need a Letter of Income Verification from the source(s) of our monthly deposits. All I can say is I showed Immigration a copy of a Social Security Verification Letter I printed myself online and that was fine. For those using retirement pensions and other sources of income one would assume that a standard Letter of Verification from them would suffice as well. According to Immigration policy these Letters should not be older than 5 months. Personally, I would try to make them current within the same month that you are extending your visa if possible.

USING THE 65K/MONTH METHOD AND NOT HAVING 12 CONSECUTIVE DEPOSITS ON RECORD YET.

I initiated direct deposits to a Thai bank in January when the announcement was first made. To date I have 5 monthly deposits on record and will have 8 on record when my renewal in September arrives. I asked the same gentleman if in fact they were going to show lenience this first year as announced by the previous Commissioner of Immigration or not. He said that would be up to the Captain. I then informed him that the primary purpose of my visit to Immigration was to speak with the Captain about this very issue. He told me I could speak to him in September. I politely requested to speak to him here and now.

He was very courteous and asked one of the girls sitting behind the counter to arrange this. A minute later I was invited to speak with the Colonel of Immigration who apparently runs the Jomtien operations.

He was very courteous as well and took the time to hear my concern. He reviewed my Bank Letter and passport and stated that I should have no problem in September as long as the monthly deposits continued. I am not writing this now as any type of guarantee that if you don't have 12 consecutive deposits on record that you will automatically be approved for extension because you may need to jump through some hoops. I'm simply telling you what actions I felt were necessary to ensure that my extension will be approved.

MANDATORY HEALTH INSURANCE

Before exiting the Colonel's office I opened up my passport - showed him the O-A stamp on the first page - and then flipped to the back and showed him the last few Long Stay Extension Stamps (marked Retirement), immediately followed by the question; "Do I need to show poof of insurance or not". His immediate and direct answer was "No", although after a slight hesitation said that "at least now it's not required" indicating of course this may change in the future.

In summary, it doesn't matter what type of visa you had when you retired (O-A or O). If you are currently retired in Thailand and have at least one Extension of Stay stamp in your passport no proof of insurance is required at present.

OTHER IMMIGRATION DISTRICTS

As we've all become aware, Policies in Thailand, like the one's we're dealing with now, are permitted to vary from District to District. The information I received today only pertains to Chonburi (Jomtien) Immigration.

I hope this information is helpful.

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Gaybutton
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Re: Retirement extension

Post by Gaybutton » Tue Jun 18, 2019 7:24 pm

Dodger wrote:
Tue Jun 18, 2019 5:28 pm
I hope this information is helpful.
It is VERY helpful. Thank you for posting it. This information will hopefully eliminate a lot of anxiety and confusion.

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Re: Retirement extension

Post by RichLB » Tue Jun 18, 2019 8:32 pm

Thanks so much for these clarifications.

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