Retirement visa extension update

[Gaybutton]

I just completed my annual retirement visa extension (bkkguy, if you're still with us, just for you I used the word "extension"). There are a few things you need to be aware of. First, be aware the my visa is the "O" visa. I don't know if there are any differences if you have the "O-A" visa. I was not asked anything about medical insurance.

It is my understanding that immigration offices are supposed to allow you to do the extension up to 45 days in advance of the visa expiration date. However, Pattaya immigration only allows up to 30 days in advance. I did mine 28 days in advance. Another example of immigration offices making their own rules. I always try to do my extension as far in advance as allowed. That way, if any unexpected complications arise you have time to deal with it before your visa expires and you find yourself on overstay. If that happens, whether it is your fault or not, it's not going to end well.

You need the usual document copies - main passport page, first visa page, current visa page, TM-30 receipt, Departure card (if it still applies), current 90-day address report receipt and the filled out TM-7 application form. And don't forget to sign every page of every document.

You also need a copy of your residence rental or ownership documents. Until now, every year they would simply glance at mine to make sure it is in order and give it right back, but this time they took and kept the whole thing - and they did not return it when I picked up my passport with the visa stamp. So bring a copy, not the original.

There is also a new requirement for "letter for immigration" from the bank for those using the 800,000 baht method (I have no idea what those using the 65,000 baht method need from the bank). Now they require a printout of every transaction done with that bank for the entire year. That can be dozens of pages. Fortunately, you don't have to sign those pages, but you do have to sign all the other bank documents. For me, this was new. I've never had to submit that before, but luckily the bank knew it and printed them out with all the other "letter for immigration" documents.

Don't forget - immigration wants all the banking information to be current with the same day you apply for the extension. Your bank book must show a transaction that same day. I simply deposited a couple hundred baht and had the bank update the passbook.

Also don't forget immigration charges 1900 baht for the visa. I didn't think to ask if you can "scanner pay". I paid cash. Don't forget to have the 1900 baht with you. If anyone finds out if immigration - at least Pattaya immigration - will or will not accept "scanner pay", please post and let us know.

Last, but not least, along with your bank book and piles of all the other required documents - don't forget to bring your passport.

Regarding "scanner pay" - since Thailand is trying to move toward a cashless society, it would make sense if immigration would accept "scanner pay" - and that's exactly why I think they probably don't accept it . . .

[Jun]

Regarding "scanner pay" - since Thailand is trying to move toward a cashless society, it would make sense if immigration would accept "scanner pay" - and that's exactly why I think they probably don't accept it . . .

Bank transactions leave records.

Would their preferred form of payment be in a brown envelope from the agencies ?

[thewayhelooks]

Am I missing something?

Now they require a printout of every transaction done with that bank for the entire year. That can be dozens of pages. Fortunately, you don't have to sign those pages, but you do have to sign all the other bank documents. For me, this was new. I've never had to submit that before, but luckily the bank knew it and printed them out with all the other "letter for immigration" documents.

I've always printed out every page of my bankbook for the previous 12 months. The bank has never done that. I just ask them to update the book even if it means having extra printouts stapled into the back of my bankbook when they run out of space.
The bank statement is separate and costs B100.

[Gaybutton]

Am I missing something?

All I've ever had to do before was show a copy of the main page and last page of the bank passbook, showing the balance and a transaction on the same day as applying for the visa. The bank never offered anything else and the immigration agent never asked for anything else. Now, for whatever reasons, immigration wants it.

Showing a printout of every transaction for the entire year is something new to me. The bank simply did it and included it with their other documents.

I didn't ask questions. I simply took what they gave me and handed it in at immigration, while wondering if anyone was really going to review all my transactions for a year, let alone do the same for every applicant for the retirement visa. Just more useless paperwork that will no doubt eventually end up in the bin without anyone having ever so much as cast a glance at it.

[Gaybutton]

Would their preferred form of payment be in a brown envelope from the agencies ?

Even though the agencies offer it, I don't know anybody who has ever actually used an agent to get their retirement visa or extend it. I don't know if an agency can somehow bypass immigration's clear requirement that for retirement visas, the applicant has to show up personally.

The process is actually quite simple as long as you gather the paperwork. I don't know what anyone would use an agency for when it is basically a paperwork laden formality. Immigration will for sure reject an applicant who doesn't have all the required paperwork, but they seem to be much more interested in the amount of money you have in a Thai bank account. What would an agency do that you can't easily do yourself? I have heard that some agencies will front the bank account money for those who don't have enough. That might be a reason some people go to the agencies.

I would imagine the people who might use an agency are people who live nowhere near an immigration office, although that would still require a trip to Pattaya just to go to an agency.

I'm guessing the people most likely to use an agency are those who think their application will likely be rejected for some reason or other or people whose application did get rejected. The agencies do advertise they can get the retirement visa, so it does cause me to wonder about how that brown envelope just might fit in. I just hope I won't ever have to be among the people who have to personally find out.

Of course most of us are well aware of different immigration offices making up their own rules. I wouldn't be surprised if certain rules have been made for agencies.

I hate going through it every year, but I always do it myself without any problems. Since it is only once a year, while I don't like it, I also don't mind it. It's really simple and takes up two or three hours in the morning between going to the bank and hoping to get to immigration before it gets too crowded. Just try to plan your visit on a date and time when immigration is least likely to be a madhouse. Days like that are few and far between.

It would be nice if Thailand would offer long-stay expats who have made Thailand their home and have lived in Thailand for a specified number of years consecutively something better than having to go through these extensions every year. I don't want one of those hundreds of thousands of baht visas. I doubt I would want one of those even if I could easily afford it. Just give us some sort of multi year visa at a reasonable price. Also, since none of us are getting any younger, personally running down to immigration every year can get quite difficult, especially if the applicant is disabled or simply not up to it anymore. Maybe they do have provisions for that, but if they do, I'm not aware of anything.

[2lz2p]

Am I missing something?

All I've ever had to do before was show a copy of the main page and last page of the bank passbook, showing the balance and a transaction on the same day as applying for the visa. The bank never offered anything else and the immigration agent never asked for anything else. Now, for whatever reasons, immigration wants it.

Showing a printout of every transaction for the entire year is something new to me. The bank simply did it and included it with their other documents.

I didn't ask questions. I simply took what they gave me and handed it in at immigration, while wondering if anyone was really going to review all my transactions for a year, let alone do the same for every applicant for the retirement visa. Just more useless paperwork that will no doubt eventually end up in the bin without anyone having ever so much as cast a glance at it.

I'm surprised that they didn't require the bank record for the entire year at your last extension renewal. The purpose is not to review your individual transactions - but rather that your account balance did not fall below the required thresholds - at least 800k for 2 months before and 3 months after extension and at least 400k all other times. Based on reports, copies of your passbook for the entire period since the last renewal was acceptable unless it was not kept up to date, i.e. no combined entries. If not kept up to date,they wanted bank certified statements for the period.

The Pattaya City Expats Club (PCEC) has a checklist for documents usually required for an extension of stay - https://pcec.club/CHECKLISTS-Extensions-of-Stay/

'm guessing the people most likely to use an agency are those who think their application will likely be rejected for some reason or other or people whose application did get rejected. The agencies do advertise they can get the retirement visa, so it does cause me to wonder about how that brown envelope just might fit in. I just hope I won't ever have to be among the people who have to personally find out.

Of course most of us are well aware of different immigration offices making up their own rules. I wouldn't be surprised if certain rules have been made for agencies.

I hate going through it every year, but I always do it myself without any problems. Since it is only once a year, while I don't like it, I also don't mind it. It's really simple and takes up two or three hours in the morning between going to the bank and hoping to get to immigration before it gets too crowded. Just try to plan your visit on a date and time when immigration is least likely to be a madhouse. Days like that are few and far between.

It would be nice if Thailand would offer long-stay expats who have made Thailand their home and have lived in Thailand for a specified number of years consecutively something better than having to go through these extensions every year. I don't want one of those hundreds of thousands of baht visas. I doubt I would want one of those even if I could easily afford it. Just give us some sort of multi year visa at a reasonable price. Also, since none of us are getting any younger, personally running down to immigration every year can get quite difficult, especially if the applicant is disabled or simply not up to it anymore. Maybe they do have provisions for that, but if they do, I'm not aware of anything.

I know some individuals that meet requirements but just don't want to deal with Immigration and thus use an agent and are willing to pay an agent to do it for them. For others that don't meet the financial qualifications, the agents "facilitate" the renewal (that was a term used an Agent that gave a presentation to the PCEC).

Like GB, I have always done it myself. As to bank letter being the same date, I have usually obtained mine the day before and am at Immigration when they open (before the banks open) and never had a problem with them accepting the bank letters (I use the 65k monthly income method, so I have to have 2 bank letters - the usual one confirming the account and showing the balance as of the day of the letter and another listing all deposits from outside of Thailand deposited into the account for the preceding year).

As to GB's last comment, I agree completely. It would be nice if they could set up a system whereby after one does several one year renewals they then be allowed to extend for a longer period, say after first 5 years one would qualify to do it say every 5 years thereafter.

[2lz2p]

Am I missing something?

All I've ever had to do before was show a copy of the main page and last page of the bank passbook, showing the balance and a transaction on the same day as applying for the visa. The bank never offered anything else and the immigration agent never asked for anything else. Now, for whatever reasons, immigration wants it.

Showing a printout of every transaction for the entire year is something new to me. The bank simply did it and included it with their other documents.

I didn't ask questions. I simply took what they gave me and handed it in at immigration, while wondering if anyone was really going to review all my transactions for a year, let alone do the same for every applicant for the retirement visa. Just more useless paperwork that will no doubt eventually end up in the bin without anyone having ever so much as cast a glance at it.

I'm surprised that they didn't require the bank record for the entire year at your last extension renewal. The purpose is not to review your individual transactions - but rather that your account balance did not fall below the required thresholds - at least 800k for 2 months before and 3 months after extension and at least 400k all other times. Based on reports, copies of your passbook for the entire period since the last renewal was acceptable unless it was not kept up to date, i.e. no combined entries. If not kept up to date,they wanted bank certified statements for the period.

The Pattaya City Expats Club (PCEC) has a checklist for documents usually required for an extension of stay - https://pcec.club/CHECKLISTS-Extensions-of-Stay/

'm guessing the people most likely to use an agency are those who think their application will likely be rejected for some reason or other or people whose application did get rejected. The agencies do advertise they can get the retirement visa, so it does cause me to wonder about how that brown envelope just might fit in. I just hope I won't ever have to be among the people who have to personally find out.

I know some individuals that meet requirements but just don't want to deal with Immigration and thus use an agent and are willing to pay an agent to do it for them. For others that don't meet the financial qualifications, the agents "facilitate" the renewal (that was a term used an Agent that gave a presentation to the PCEC).

Like GB, I have always done it myself. As to bank letter being the same date, I have usually obtained mine the day before and am at Immigration when they open (before the banks open) and never had a problem with them accepting the bank letters (I use the 65k monthly income method, so I have to have 2 bank letters - the usual one confirming the account and showing the balance as of the day of the letter and another listing all deposits from outside of Thailand deposited into the account for the preceding year).

As to GB's last comment, I agree completely. It would be nice if they could set up a system whereby after one does several one year renewals they then be allowed to extend for a longer period, say after first 5 years one would qualify to do it say every 5 years thereafter.

[Gaybutton]

I know some individuals that meet requirements but just don't want to deal with Immigration and thus use an agent and are willing to pay an agent to do it for them.

That's my question. What do the agents do that you don't have to do yourself anyway? And how much do the agents charge for it?

I'm trying to understand what makes going to an agent worth it. What does the agent actually do?

I'm surprised that they didn't require the bank record for the entire year at your last extension renewal. The purpose is not to review your individual transactions - but rather that your account balance did not fall below the required thresholds - at least 800k for 2 months before and 3 months after extension and at least 400k all other times.

And someone sits there and does that for every applicant? What a dull job that must be.

I have no idea what the contents of "letter for immigration" from the bank are, but I thought their letter would cover that. I guess it doesn't.

[Gaybutton]

your account balance did not fall below the required thresholds - at least 800k for 2 months before and 3 months after extension and at least 400k all other times.

Now that you mention it, for the past several years, at the time I picked up the visa, immigration would always give me a document on which I had to show that my account balance remained within regulations and bring it in after 3 months. This year, I was not given that document.

So, if I'm lucky and the 90-day address reports online actually work, then I won't need to bother with immigration until the next visa extension.

[Dodger]

As to GB's last comment, I agree completely. It would be nice if they could set up a system whereby after one does several one year renewals they then be allowed to extend for a longer period, say after first 5 years one would qualify to do it say every 5 years thereafter.

I agree too, but to be blunt; there's just too much tea money at stake for them to shorten the renewal durations.

I did some simple math once to get an idea how much money is funneling through the Visa Agent Pipeline to Immigration and needed more buttons on my calculator. It's an enormous amount of money (billions) just in one province.

A high percentage of expats are paying agents anywhere between 9,000 - 14,000 THB for annual extension renewal services. Some comply with the requirements and are simply using an agent for convenience - and others are unable to comply (usually because of insufficient funds) and have no choice but to use an agent.

If Immigration were to extend visa renewals for qualifying expats to 5 years as mentioned they would immediately experience an 80% reduction in tea money.

Here's a twist:

Why do retired expats even need a visa?

If Thailand considers expats who reside in Thailand for >180 days/year as "Legal Residents" for tax filing purposes, then they should be considered "Legal Residents" for everything else.

It's all about the Tea Money!